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Fondant icing...
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climbeyalex



Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 5:20 pm    Post subject: Fondant icing... Reply with quote

I'm getting married in august and I'm having some thoughts about the kind of cake I want. And once of the icings of choice is fondant because it can be so darn pretty and the cake might end up being a DIY effort between some friends and I, and fondant might be the only thing to stand up to 30 degree C weather and 90% humidity. But I've heard about fondant's notorious 'yuck' tasting. So what exactly can be done to make it taste better? And is there any other frostings that can stand up to high temperatures and humidity and also, won't get all icky with rose petals scattered all over them?
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Last edited by climbeyalex on Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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gisele



Joined: 28 Mar 2006
Posts: 154
Location: North of Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you mean by the "yuck" taste? The only thing I can think of would be the marzipan layer that is generally used between the fondant and the cake, especially in fruit cakes. I know a lot of people don't like the taste of this.

I'm no cake decorator, I only know some of the very basics, but I believe you can use a layer of buttercream under the fondant if you so choose. However, Im not sure that this will really last in that sort of heat though.

Or a layer of jam under the fondant? I believe that is a standard thing anyway? This will help it stick to the cake after it's all rolled out, and provide a different taste. Jam would be dependent on the flavour of the cake, maybe a raspberry for a chocolate cake perhaps?

Im sure there are other people in this forum who have far more experience than me in cake decorating who can offer a more knowledgable answer than I.
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Deni



Joined: 25 Jul 2006
Posts: 52
Location: Kona, Hawaii

PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 2:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I reside in the Hawaiian Islands where the humidity (averaging 86%) plays a major part in almost everything I do in the patisserie. Yes, you can use marzipan as a foundation for the rolled fondant. I say rolled as opposed to a poured fondant. Both can be flavored with essential oils, however be certain of your flavors, as once used its hard to change horses in mid stream, so to speak. Professionally speaking, I would stay away from jams used as a base for the fondant. They will cause the fondant to break down and sweat, something that is detrimental to the cakes appearance. I occasionally use buttercrèmes but try to refrain from these short-lived coatings. If you insist on a buttercrème I can suggest having the baker/decorator use a Swiss buttercrème, starting with a good crumb coating for a base. Lastly a poured ganache almost always gives a great finished, highly glossy appearance. These are only limited to the type of chocolate that is currently in vogue in your area. If you seek more answers to your wedding cake dilemma, ask away. Best of luck…
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climbeyalex



Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, thanks for the answers. My one meory of fondant icing wasn't good. It tasted sort of like plastic and was hard and chewy in a bad way. I can still remember after a decade. Either it was really bad fodant or I dunno. I've been experimenting with buttercream frostings. And I found a recipe which claims that crisco with a bit of butter for flavouring produces a unmeltable buttercream. So if I haven't figured fondant out by then, I think I'll just clog all my guests' arteries.
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Last edited by climbeyalex on Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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georgia



Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 456
Location: california

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Climbeyalex, please think long and hard about that crisco option! Seems to me I have that recipe somewhere, a holdover from a couple of decades ago. Do you really want a "frosting" of crisco, flavored with butter or anything else? I have eaten this frosting, and the mouthfeel is exactly as you'd expect: like a flavored, sweet (to make matters worse...sugar doesn't dissolve in this mixture, so you've got grit along with fat), mouthful of crisco.

Or have I panicked and that was a joke? See what the memory of crisco buttercream can do to a (usually) rational human? She rushes to judgment and offers crazed advice to a complete stranger. Embarassed
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Deni



Joined: 25 Jul 2006
Posts: 52
Location: Kona, Hawaii

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't do it...
The mouth feel is simply GREASY.
Its not worth the let down for your pending wedding day.
A Swiss buttercrème is a meringue made with whites that have been heated with the sugar to 140 degrees F. (60 C.), and then whipped to a firm peak. At that point unsalted butter that has been paddled soft is added then whipped into the meringue. Flavourings are added after the butter. If you would like a formula I will provide you with a great one.
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Deni

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Deni



Joined: 25 Jul 2006
Posts: 52
Location: Kona, Hawaii

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 4:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good call Georgia...
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Donna



Joined: 14 Oct 2005
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Location: Oakland, CA

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 6:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hear, hear! A meringue buttercream! (Interestingly, Deni, that's what I call an Italian buttercream- with the meringue made with a simple syrup and butter added)

It is very stable and that's just what you want.

Laughing
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Lady Amalthea



Joined: 18 Dec 2004
Posts: 136
Location: New York City

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Donna wrote:
Hear, hear! A meringue buttercream! (Interestingly, Deni, that's what I call an Italian buttercream- with the meringue made with a simple syrup and butter added)


I've never heard of a meringue buttercream, but it sounds delicious! Keep us posted on how you decide to flavor it, if this is, in fact, what you end up going with.
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Deni



Joined: 25 Jul 2006
Posts: 52
Location: Kona, Hawaii

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Donna,
Just to clarify things referring to what you called Italian Buttercrème.
There are 3 basic types of B-Crème, Swiss, Italian, and French.
The Swiss is made with bain-marie heated whites & sugar to 140 F. then whipped, butter added while this happens.
Italian is made with a softball sugar (244-250 F.) added to the foamed whites, the butter is paddle in.
French B-crème or as I know it crème au beurre uses yolks that have soft ball sugar added to it as it whips then unsalted butter is paddled in.

I am clarifying this because the Italian B-crème weeps in the tropics, thus I recommended the Swiss variety. I do hope that I am not being too anal for the group, it’s just that there is so much bad advice & even worse formulas out there in cyberspace...
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gisele



Joined: 28 Mar 2006
Posts: 154
Location: North of Auckland, New Zealand

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all that information Deni. I love being able to learn from people in all different walks of life in this forum. Very valuable.

That jam info is interesting, im not even sure where I got that from but I know I read it in a book somewhere. Must tell my step-mum about that.

Good luck climbeyalex with finding a solution for your wedding cake! I never would have thought about all the problems that can be associated with a wedding cake in the tropics!

Btw, I have had that buttercream with crisco stuff in it before and it is truly horrible, combined with sponge it didn't do any wonders for the palate.
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climbeyalex



Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alright, alright, relax, all. I was half kidding about the crisco. I mean, if I was TRULY desperate, maybe. But I am not desperate. Yet. I am going to experiment with a swiss buttercream this week. Only just got the cupcake recipe down.

And sugar doesn't dissolve in crisco? Why am I sort of not surprised? I have a couple of words to describe my last few run-ins with crisco: Engine Oil. I could probably grease my bicycle with that stuff.
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Last edited by climbeyalex on Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Debbie



Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 861
Location: Paris

PostPosted: Mon Jan 22, 2007 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I normally do not like the rolled icing also... it usually has almond flavour in it - which I hate! Evil or Very Mad

For my wedding I asked a friends Mum (who was a whizz with rolled icing and decorated wedding cakes herself as a hobby) to cover the cake I had made, and then I decorated it myself. The effect of the icing was professional, but she omitted the dreaded almond flavour, which made the cake perfect for me. All the guests commented on the icing being the nicest they had eaten on a wedding cake... which I think may be due to the almond essence being left out.

The other trick that my friends Mum explained is that if the icing is fairly freshly done before the wedding it is not as hard and has a softer texture and taste. Deni may be able to explain the reason for this to us all.

I was also advised to go for rolled icing as our wedding was second week of february in Sydney.... very hot and humid. Even though the day was over 35 degrees, the cake looked fabulous and didn't suffer the effects of the heat as much as we did! Wink
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climbeyalex



Joined: 22 Nov 2005
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2007 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Debbie, just how fresh is 'fairly freshly done'? If I do the cupcakes myself, they'd have to sit for half a day after being descorated before being given away.
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Last edited by climbeyalex on Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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rohobu



Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 4
Location: Houston, TX

PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

climbeyalex, I agree with you - I think fondant is so pretty, but oh, so nasty tasting! And working with my chef/husband (but we don't do cakes), I can tell you that when I clean up, MANY plates have fondant on them because the guests have scraped it off their cake.

However, my mom has decorated 100's of wedding cakes and she has always used a crisco/butter frosting (because we live in Houston) and still has people begging her to make cakes for them (but she has arthritis). Maybe she just has the right mix of crisco and butter, because I know I don't like ANY others I have tasted. Maybe it's worth a trial run on cupcakes?

I can get her recipe if you want it. If not, that's ok - we all have our likes/dislikes! Rolling Eyes
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